ROB SCHMITZ, HOST:
The last time that the music publication Pitchfork gave a 0.0 rating to a new album from a single artist, the entirety of the review was a video of, well, something we cannot describe on the radio. That was 2006. Twenty years later, it's again bestowed the honor - or dishonor - to the new '80s concept album from the rapper Tyga called "$tarface."
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "JUST US TONIGHT")
TYGA: (Singing) Just us tonight. Keep it steady and right. Hold me so tight.
SCHMITZ: At the heart of the review is Tyga's admission that he, the artist, used AI to create it. Let's talk about that with Alex Suskind. He's news director for Pitchfork. Welcome to ALL THINGS CONSIDERED, Alex.
ALEX SUSKIND: Thanks for having me, Rob.
SCHMITZ: Thanks for being here. What do we know about how Tyga used AI on this album?
SUSKIND: Well, not a whole lot, I will say. Initially, Tyga was pretty firm in stating that he created the whole album himself with his collaborators. People were accusing him of using AI, and he - yeah, he stood pretty firm and was saying, no, no, I didn't. And then in an interview I believe with VIBE just ahead of the album drop, he basically just changed his tune and said, well, I did create it with AI. However, all of the vocals and the writing of the hooks are all mine. I did that myself.
SCHMITZ: OK, so I'm bracing myself here a little. Let's listen together to a track from this concept album. The title is called "Affection." This is by Tyga.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "AFFECTION")
TYGA: (Singing) She want money and affection. We was dancing in the dark, took a chance...
SCHMITZ: OK. I mean, that - to me, that sounds like many songs from the 1980s.
SUSKIND: The first time I heard it, frankly, sure, yes, it does have, like, hallmarks of what you might consider '80s music, but it struck me as sort of bad video game music.
SCHMITZ: (Laughter) OK. So, Alex, I'm curious, Pitchfork gave this album a 0.0. Is that a statement, or is that just something that you mathematically landed on?
SUSKIND: Well, I can't speak exactly to that because I am on the news side, and I don't really touch the reviews. But I would say it was maybe a little bit of column A, column B.
SCHMITZ: Yeah.
SUSKIND: As you stated, we haven't done a 0.0 rating in nearly two decades. So when it comes to criticism, especially criticism of an album that we consider bad, we want to still take the work seriously. We're not only taking Tyga's album at face value. We're also, with a 0.0, making a bit of a statement about the album itself and what it represents at the moment.
SCHMITZ: So Tyga told VIBE magazine, and I'm paraphrasing here, "why are people overexplaining how they make good music?" Though he used an expletive in his comment. The idea being, what does it matter how it's made if it sounds good? I'm wondering what you make of that comment.
SUSKIND: (Laughter) It's not really savvy, but he's basically pulling what musicians -especially, like, big musicians - for years have done. Like, I don't want to tell you the sauce. You know, I don't want to explain everything. It's up to...
SCHMITZ: Right.
SUSKIND: ...The interpretation of the listener. And he's sort of, like, taking that, I'd say, fairly defensible argument and using it to pawn off on music that he clearly didn't put a lot of effort in in the first place.
SCHMITZ: How widespread do you think using AI is among musicians these days?
SUSKIND: It is quite widespread. First and foremost, you know, artists - a lot of artists are not going to want to go on the record to say that they're using it. But, you know, I'll point you to several interviews that Harvey Mason Jr., the CEO of the Recording Academy, has given. In addition to being CEO, he's a working songwriter and producer, and he has been in pop and R&B rooms where people are using AI to do everything from filling out drum loops to replicating verses and choruses in other parts of the song to fully replicating music in the first place. So yeah, it is happening, certainly. And, you know, whether you think it's troubling or not, you know, depends on your stance on AI in the first place.
SCHMITZ: That is Alex Suskind. He's news director at Pitchfork. Thanks so much for joining us.
SUSKIND: Thanks, Rob.
SCHMITZ: We reached out to Tyga's representative for comment but did not hear back immediately. Recently, when asked about the topic by TMZ, Tyga repeated his claim that he did not use generative AI for his vocals or songwriting and said, this was just an experiment, and this was fun. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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